AT-28D-5

Reference the smoke .... Why not set it to RPM and Airspeed for on ? Both need to be met for on. In RF I do this by setting up the two conditions then use a mix of the two with minimum as the condition. Then if the prop isn't spinning or the aircraft isn't moving .... No smoke.
My Computer is down ... Have not been following ... So not sure if this has been discussed. Using a Amazon Fire for this response!
 
Well, I really just see a very slight difference, here are some pics., so you can be be judge...first one is the sunny side....second one is the shaded side, and the third, looking straight down on the right wing, where I can see them, but just barely. This is at flight school (not HD), Also, I`m aware about the white washing things out, that`s why I`ve brought it to your attention, perhaps some of the other s that have downloaded it can post some pics. for comparison, The prop looks excellent BTW... 👍👍
Thanks for the pictures boy you sure can't see them much. I've been looking at the Castle field I'll take a look at the standard Flight School here and see what it looks like. Have you changed the Sun angle?
 
Reference the smoke .... Why not set it to RPM and Airspeed for on ? Both need to be met for on. In RF I do this by setting up the two conditions then use a mix of the two with minimum as the condition. Then if the prop isn't spinning or the aircraft isn't moving .... No smoke.
My Computer is down ... Have not been following ... So not sure if this has been discussed. Using a Amazon Fire for this response!
Yes that would probably shut the smoke off a little faster because the prop is probably spinning above my limit when the plane first stops. And would allow you to rev up some and start moving before the smoke started. Thanks for the comment.

So do you feed a Speed Sensor and RPM Sensor into a Multi-Mixer?
 
No, the sun angle is at the default position, which I assume is at high noon... :unsure:
Okay thanks. They're definitely washed out. Being honest I'm thinking about dumping the panel lines and rivets when I release it they're just too hard to see on that white.
 
Reference the smoke .... Why not set it to RPM and Airspeed for on ? Both need to be met for on. In RF I do this by setting up the two conditions then use a mix of the two with minimum as the condition. Then if the prop isn't spinning or the aircraft isn't moving .... No smoke.
My Computer is down ... Have not been following ... So not sure if this has been discussed. Using a Amazon Fire for this response!
Another question. What speed do you use on the Smoke Servo? Mine normally is set to 1 second but for this control scheme I'm not sure it needs a delay in the servo. The one concern I have doing Air Speed and RPM is the extra compute cycles it takes to do that every physics frame rate.
 
I've done a few things to address some issues so I'm going to upload a new beta for you guys to test.

@uncle twist I went back and made the panel lines and rivets darker but not as dark as they were before I lightened them. Just so you know. In the beta you have now where you say you'd like them a little darker the Opacity of the Panel Lines and Rivets was set to "8%" so I increased the Opacity to "18%" and you can definitely see them better. But you need to remember that a White Background always seems to wash them out so please let me know "how you" like them in the new Beta. Are they better and you want to keep them that way or do you want me to go back to the lighter version like you have now. I need your thoughts on them. Thanks !!!

@asj5547 After thinking about the smoke control more I went ahead and added it. I definitely like to fly with smoke so I'm going to leave smoke in the release but you were definitely right about the smoke looking wrong when the motor isn't spinning. There's two ways I could have done it but I like to use the "minimum" smoke set at "2%" so when you shut off the throttle you still have a very light trail of smoke so I used an RPM Sensor to shut off the smoke when the RPM is "below 200". So after you land as the motor spins down the smoke will turn off at 200 rpm and stay off until you start the motor again. On my radio (Interlink-X) I can give it 1 click of throttle which is about 50 rpm but on the 2nd click of throttle the smoke starts. Please try this out and let me know if it works for you. And if the RPM I'm using seems right to you. I can tweak it if needed.

The truth is you can buy smoke kits for electric planes so it's not really that bad to include smoke on an EP. And a plane like this would be a prime candidate for a smoke kit. Aerobatics at a show type of thing.

Also the custom Prop I created is in this beta I think it adds a nice touch to the plane.

Flaps: Channel 6 Knob
Retracts: Channel 7 Switch
Smoke: Channel 8 3 Position Switch Forward (away from you)
Canopy: Channel 8 3 Position Switch Back (towards you)
Smoke Off and Canopy Closed: Channel 8 3 Position Switch in the Center.
Brakes: Down Elevator



View attachment 129234
That version with the prop decoration looks so cool and flies so nicely.
 
I wouldn`t be so quick to do that, I haven`t looked at the s.tga file, what color do you have on the wings and fuse..(white parts of the plane) ??? Maybe use a darker color to cut the sheen down a lot.??
Yeah the Alpha Layer of the SPEC MAP is what controls the Gloss then the Main RGB Layer controls the strength of the Color. At one point I added the Panel Lines and Rivets to the Alpha Layer with a much darker color to cut the gloss just for them but it sort of looked strange having the panel lines and rivets flatter looking than the rest of the parts. It did help some but I don't remember how much.

I do have another idea I'm going to try. Often (like now) I'll use an All Black part and adjust the Opacity to control the color of it (gray scale), which generally works just fine. But I'm wondering since the Opacity is pretty low (8% first and 18% now) if that causes them to be washed out easily. So I'm going to make a copy of that Layer in my CS file and select all the pixels and then paint them with a light to medium gray and see what that does. So I'll play with it a little more. But if I do dump them I can always release a color scheme with them for those that want them. In fact that was my initial plan since I don't generally care that much for them. Ha.. I'm a simple monokote type RC guy. So we'll see how it goes.
 
Well, I tried to load a pic. of what I did to the s.tga file, but I can`t for some reason, but in a nutshell, I bucket filled the right wing in a very dark gray, in order to knock down the gloss, you can see what it did to the orange if you compare the two wings in the second pic., you can see the left wing looks washed out, whereas the right wing looks flat, which is close to my real world T-28 in terms of glossiness,. THEN, what I did in the .tga file, (PIC. # ONE) was to bucket fill the panel lines (in gimp) with a very dark gray, with a threshold setting of 5.9 (in order to not color the whole wing), then hit the rivets with a fuzzy brush (size 2) with an darker gray, almost black...Back to pic. #2, you can see the result in RF (magnify it) when you walk up close to it. The lines and rivets are visible, but not overwhelming. IMHO, that`s the look I think you should be going for, or close to it (however you go about it), so all the work you put into them can be seen.
 

Attachments

  • T-28 WINGS.PNG
    T-28 WINGS.PNG
    79.4 KB · Views: 10
  • ScreenShot1651464992.jpg
    ScreenShot1651464992.jpg
    273 KB · Views: 11
Technoid the model fly's great and the smoke operation is perfect, just the right amount of smoke especially on start up and flying with pilot's view
(F4 Camera angle).
The new prop is awesome, nice artwork with the Hamilton Standard decal.
 
Technoid the model fly's great and the smoke operation is perfect, just the right amount of smoke especially on start up and flying with pilot's view
(F4 Camera angle).
The new prop is awesome, nice artwork with the Hamilton Standard decal.
Thanks ASJ I appreciate you checking it out. I have one last tweak to do to the prop I want to reduce the depth of the hub a tiny bit to match some of the built-in props I've looked at.
 
Well, I tried to load a pic. of what I did to the s.tga file, but I can`t for some reason, but in a nutshell, I bucket filled the right wing in a very dark gray, in order to knock down the gloss, you can see what it did to the orange if you compare the two wings in the second pic., you can see the left wing looks washed out, whereas the right wing looks flat, which is close to my real world T-28 in terms of glossiness,. THEN, what I did in the .tga file, (PIC. # ONE) was to bucket fill the panel lines (in gimp) with a very dark gray, with a threshold setting of 5.9 (in order to not color the whole wing), then hit the rivets with a fuzzy brush (size 2) with an darker gray, almost black...Back to pic. #2, you can see the result in RF (magnify it) when you walk up close to it. The lines and rivets are visible, but not overwhelming. IMHO, that`s the look I think you should be going for, or close to it (however you go about it), so all the work you put into them can be seen.
Cool work UT it looks great. I've been working on it this morning too and I'll post an update with what I've done next. But one question, what is the HEX Value of the color you put on the right wing in the S.TGA. Did you modify the Alpah Layer or the Main RGB Layer?
 
Like UT I worked on the panel lines and rivets this morning. Yesterday I got the idea that using the ALL BLACK panel lines and rivets layer I normally use and then set the Opacity to give me the shade of gray I wanted wasn't the right way to do it. So this morning I created a copy of that layer and selected all the pixels in it and filled them with a medium gray and it definitely helped show the panel lines and rivets. Then I got the idea to also make the panel lines and rivets in the orange area a little darker orange to boost them a little too.

So now I have a separate layer with panel lines and rivets for the White Areas of the plane and another layer with panel lines and rivets for the Orange Areas of the plane. This way I can tailor the rivets in the White and Orange Areas separately.

The color of the panel lines and rivets in the White Area of the plane has been reduced $30 Hex from the normal white color.

The color of the panel lines and rivets in the Orange Area of the plane has been reduced $18 Hex from the normal orange color.

I also changed the color in the spec map for all the plane parts from $707070 Hex to $606060 Hex (probably not as much as UT reduced it)

Here's some pictures. One in the editor, one on the runway, and one like UTs from the Top Down. My results are close to UTs but not quite as dark but if I reduce the color in the spec map alpha layer they will get darker. So I guess both of us are on the right track. But it's good UT kept after this because this is a big improvement. But I think I need to make them a tiny bit darker to get them closer to what UT did.

T-28B Trojan 20% EP 06.jpgT-28B Trojan 20% EP 07.jpgT-28B Trojan 20% EP 09.jpg
 
Okay I went back and did a couple of things. First I tried making the Spec Map Plane Parts a little darker but that reduced the gloss a little more than I wanted so I put it back where I had it. It was $606060 and I changed it to $505050 but like I said that reduced the gloss too much for me so I put it back to $606060. Second I changed the color of the panel lines and rivets in the white area of the plane from $d0d0d0 to $c0c0c0 which seemed to give me about the same results and UTs second picture so I think that might be where it needs to be. But I'll put a couple of pictures here so you can let me know what you think.

Both of these pictures are untouched screen shots from RealFlight I say that because I normally reduce the size to 1280x720 to lower the file size a little. But I noticed UT put a full screen shot in his 2nd picture so I wanted to match what he did for a direct comparison. So UT take a look at these pictures (everyone else too) and let me know if this is where it should be or what it needs. Thanks for you help on this.

T-28B Trojan 20% EP 10.jpgT-28B Trojan 20% EP 11.jpg
 
Cool work UT it looks great. I've been working on it this morning too and I'll post an update with what I've done next. But one question, what is the HEX Value of the color you put on the right wing in the S.TGA. Did you modify the Alpah Layer or the Main RGB Layer?
HA..Well, I don`t know what a/the HEX value is, so I can`t help you there, I can tell you that the color I put on the right wing in s.tga file is real close to blackest gimp can achieve, my goal was to knock down the glare on the white almost as much as possible. if you can tell me where to locate that value in gimp, I might be able to help with that. After all these years I still don`t deal with layers Alpha layer...what the heck is that, I sort of have an idea Buuuuut, still not exactly sure...RGB layer...Well to me, (and correct me if I`m wrong) that`s the .tga file, well, at least to me, SO, back to point, in/on the .tga file, all I did was color the panel lines a light to med. gray, and the rivets a fairly dark gray, they didn`t stand out as much with the med. gray I used on the lines, so I went with a darker gray. Looking at the two pics. above, it appears the right wing lines are darker than the left wings, So, did you only do one wing darker for comparison, or are they both the same, or, is it`s just the pic. giving that impression..??...ANYWAY, I would say looking at the right wing, yours looks just slightly darker than what I got, but still looks good....... TO ME, the whole point is to make them visible to the point that they can be seen, but not so much so that they`re unrealistic (to dark) after all they`re just shadows in the real world when you think about it
 
HA..Well, I don`t know what a/the HEX value is, so I can`t help you there, I can tell you that the color I put on the right wing in s.tga file is real close to blackest gimp can achieve, my goal was to knock down the glare on the white almost as much as possible. if you can tell me where to locate that value in gimp, I might be able to help with that. After all these years I still don`t deal with layers Alpha layer...what the heck is that, I sort of have an idea Buuuuut, still not exactly sure...RGB layer...Well to me, (and correct me if I`m wrong) that`s the .tga file, well, at least to me, SO, back to point, in/on the .tga file, all I did was color the panel lines a light to med. gray, and the rivets a fairly dark gray, they didn`t stand out as much with the med. gray I used on the lines, so I went with a darker gray. Looking at the two pics. above, it appears the right wing lines are darker than the left wings, So, did you only do one wing darker for comparison, or are they both the same, or, is it`s just the pic. giving that impression..??...ANYWAY, I would say looking at the right wing, yours looks just slightly darker than what I got, but still looks good....... TO ME, the whole point is to make them visible to the point that they can be seen, but not so much so that they`re unrealistic (to dark) after all they`re just shadows in the real world when you think about it
Okay thanks, no biggie on all the layer and hex details. Would it be possible for you to upload the tga and s_tga files to the forum so I can grab them and see what you did first hand? From what you said you probably modified the RGB layer. Think of the RGB and ALPHA Layers as two pieces of paper laying on the table on top of each other. You can write different things on the top piece of paper and the bottom piece of paper but when you look at them laying on the table you only see what's on the top piece of paper. That's how it is in a 32 bit TGA file. The top piece of paper has 8 bits per color (256 shades for each color RedGreenBlue) so it's the RGB Layer. The bottom piece of paper has one color with 256 shades of gray so it's the ALPHA layer. There's some place to select which area your editing in GIMP but I don't know GIMP only Photoshop so I can't help there. But from what you said you worked on the RGB Layer so you changed the "strength" of the color not it's gloss, the ALPHA layer adjusts that. But each one affects the look of the plane so you got what you wanted but probably not by adjusting the ALPHA Layer. None-the-less your Results are Great.

Now for the difference in the right and left wings that's probably just how RealFlight is rendering it I did the same thing on both sides. In fact I made a layer for ALL the Panel Lines and Rivets for the White Area of the plane and painted them all the same color so "I think" the differences you see are rendering issues in RealFlight (but I don't know that for sure). But I'll take a close look at both wings and see if I can see a difference in Photshop.

So is there any changes you want me to make? I'll make a new beta and upload it so you can give me more feedback on the panel lines and rivets if you don't want me to change anything. I want you to be satisfied with them before I stop working on them. Or the best I can get them. Again thanks for all your help on this.
 
Back
Top