VR Implementation Entirely Unacceptable

I wanted to try RF9 in VR again after updating my PC and I can say that ... it really sucks! a colossal garbage!

Even at medium settings, I always see the planes doubled.
With my PC and medium settings, in 2D I go over 1000fps, obviously in VR I have a constant 40fps but the experience is the most hallucinating.
DCS, Xplane11, Aerofly RC8, Reflex XTR2 (demo) ... they all run without any problem.

I really have no words ...
Well its becuase they are using a decades old Graphics API so I guess as long as people keep buying RF they wont bother as it's cheap compared to other more graphically advanced sims... I guess at some point they will lose enough fan base and users and they will be forced to update.
 
Well its becuase they are using a decades old Graphics API so I guess as long as people keep buying RF they wont bother as it's cheap compared to other more graphically advanced sims... I guess at some point they will lose enough fan base and users and they will be forced to update.
The problem is that Oculus Rift has not caught on yet; may never. VR is dangerous, frankly... and not well enough tested to understand long term side issues. But, my main point is that most of us are using Rf9.5 (happy as clams) and running large screens-- NOT VR. This issue will not be addressed until some critical mass of users move over to VR as their primary video mode. Here's the second point, VR is a pain. While I'm using the Sim I'm constantly using my other senses and my other video feeds and my desk (or lazy boy chair) and having a VR device strapped to my head is not going to fly... so to speak.
marcus
 
The problem is that Oculus Rift has not caught on yet; may never. VR is dangerous, frankly... and not well enough tested to understand long term side issues. But, my main point is that most of us are using Rf9.5 (happy as clams) and running large screens-- NOT VR. This issue will not be addressed until some critical mass of users move over to VR as their primary video mode. Here's the second point, VR is a pain. While I'm using the Sim I'm constantly using my other senses and my other video feeds and my desk (or lazy boy chair) and having a VR device strapped to my head is not going to fly... so to speak.
marcus

The only danger of VR is to your wallet, lol! While VR is still a niche sector of the gaming/sims industry, it has grown by leaps and bounds every year since 2016. Like everything, it's not going to be everyone's cup of tea imho. For me, no way I can go back to monitors-only for gaming/sims. VR is just way too immersive for me.

I still enjoy RF9.5 on a monitor for a quick RC fix though. I'm currently about 50:50 split between RF9.5 Monitor and VR usage. With flight sims like X Plane 11 or racing sims like Assetto Corsa I'm more like 99% VR.
 
The problem is that Oculus Rift has not caught on yet; may never. VR is dangerous, frankly... and not well enough tested to understand long term side issues. But, my main point is that most of us are using Rf9.5 (happy as clams) and running large screens-- NOT VR. This issue will not be addressed until some critical mass of users move over to VR as their primary video mode. Here's the second point, VR is a pain. While I'm using the Sim I'm constantly using my other senses and my other video feeds and my desk (or lazy boy chair) and having a VR device strapped to my head is not going to fly... so to speak.
marcus
Yeah, VR isn't for everybody, but it has definitely caught on. I like it in RF for the immersion of being at the field. Try it in a Full size aircraft Simulator like X-Plane, and now MSFS and You won't ever want to go back to the flat screen. I use the new Reverb G2 and it is very very good.
 
WRONG... just because you don't like it.
You're absolutely right, but missing my main point. The issue will not get addressed until enough "critical mass" of users demand VR support to warrant the development costs. An example: sales of Rf9.x drop dramatically and EVERYONE hates Rf9.x because it can't handle 90 fps on VR. I guarantee the issue will get addressed. For all we know Horizon | Knife Edge are already slating true VR support for Rf10.0 (just an example guess).
The bottom line for this discussion is that zillions of users are using Rfxx on flat screens everywhere (and happy).
In fact, I only know one of my homies who even owns an Oculus device... and hates it (makes him sick). My club does not do FPV at the field, and all of them use the Sim on flat screens.
In the end the whole thing comes down to marketing and demand. One additional point is that you might consider thoughtfully. DirectX has an iron grip on many apps... that's why Rf9.x will not run in Linux, on Apple, or other minicomputer platforms... Rf9.5 needs DirectX 9 or higher, period. The entire app is based on DirectX. The rewrite of Rfxx to get around the need for DirectX is (I'm guessing here) way to huge for Horizon | Knife Edge to even consider it at the moment. You'll notice that they aren't really making huge changes to the product right now... just eliminating bugs and adding a few planes (which is great!). It is a really BIG ask to expect them to completely rewrite just to get VR fps to go up... its just not a high enough priority.

In a few years, Lord willing and I live, VR improves and doesn't make me sick, I may try it, if I can afford it... but I'm waiting. In fact I just bought a new curved gaming screen ( 29" ) for my lazy boy chair, and the Rf9.5 looks great on it... just saying.

marcus
 
You're absolutely right, but missing my main point.

In a few years, Lord willing and I live, VR improves and doesn't make me sick, I may try it, if I can afford it... but I'm waiting. In fact I just bought a new curved gaming screen ( 29" ) for my lazy boy chair, and the Rf9.5 looks great on it... just saying.

marcus

I don't think any of us missed the fact that you really do not have a creditable Main Point imho.

Maybe one day you will be able to afford to try FPV and VR. My club have lots of members that do both, including FPV drone racing (and PCVR drone racing as well).

Please don't try justifying your current position by rambling away subjectively. In the mean time, just enjoy what you have. That's the most important thing mate.
 
My club have lots of members that do both, including FPV drone racing (and PCVR drone racing as well).

... just enjoy what you have. That's the most important thing mate.
Absolutely. I suspect that FPV is a driving marketing factor, frankly. If you're inclined to be interested in FPV, you're going to want to practice it on the Sim. So, there is cost, and whether FPV makes the person sickish. I have noticed (from others) that if you can sit down, FPV seems to work better. I think some of it has to do with age. I am 65, and most of my club is older than I am ! I suspect the young crowd coming up is probably more inclined to use FPV, and VR. The millennial +|- crowd may drive the true VR support in Rf9.x I guess we'll see.
Does your club have specific extended rules for the use of FPV at your field; ours does, and its pretty strict, even though we're out in the country, and nine miles from the nearest airport.

PS edit: I just learned that my son's roommate has an Oculus device who has agreed to loan it for awhile. So he is going to check out the VR aspects of Rf9.5 on his system; update to follow.

marcus
 
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Absolutely. I suspect that FPV is a driving marketing factor, frankly. If you're inclined to be interested in FPV, you're going to want to practice it on the Sim. So, there is cost, and whether FPV makes the person sickish. I have noticed (from others) that if you can sit down, FPV seems to work better. I think some of it has to do with age. I am 65, and most of my club is older than I am ! I suspect the young crowd coming up is probably more inclined to use FPV, and VR. The millennial +|- crowd may drive the true VR support in Rf9.x I guess we'll see.
Does your club have specific extended rules for the use of FPV at your field; ours does, and its pretty strict, even though we're out in the country, and nine miles from the nearest airport.

PS edit: I just learned that my son's roommate has an Oculus device who has agreed to loan it for awhile. So he is going to check out the VR aspects of Rf9.5 on his system; update to follow.

marcus

I'm turning 67 next month and still having a ball with all this. You are only as old as you act, feel, and think I guess. Like most clubs these days most of our members are retired but we still also have a pretty good 15-40yo sector (which I consider to be kids, lol!) but FPV and VR are not limited to them and is pretty evenly spread out. Like all clubs in Australia we follow fairly strict MOP's (Manual of Procedures) for all facets of RC flying set out by our national governing modelling and aviation bodies. All pretty reasonable imho.

Unfortunately, Oculus headsets are not the best for RF9.5 VR. The screens are only 8bit so colours are pretty washed out and night sky's have a bit of colour banding. Best advice is to adjust the time of day (shift pageup/pagedown) to help darken the area to when night lights just turn on (if your 3D field and aircraft supports this). Colours are much better with my Vive Pro headset.
 
Unfortunately, Oculus headsets are not the best for RF9.5 VR. The screens are only 8bit so colours are pretty washed out ... colours are much better with my Vive Pro headset.
Thanks for the heads-up! ... found it on-line -->https://www.vive.com/eu/product/#pro series

I'll pass on to my son; he won't be a happy bloke with 8bit color mate! Well, begs the 10,000 $ question-- is the fps any better with VIVE than with Oculus... or about the same? I'm betting its about the same since the issue is really more|less a DirectX issue.

marcus
 
Thanks for the heads-up! ... found it on-line -->https://www.vive.com/eu/product/#pro series

I'll pass on to my son; he won't be a happy bloke with 8bit color mate! Well, begs the 10,000 $ question-- is the fps any better with VIVE than with Oculus... or about the same? I'm betting its about the same since the issue is really more|less a DirectX issue.

marcus

FPS with both my Oculus Rift cv1 and Vive Pro is the same (90fps).
 
The problem is that Oculus Rift has not caught on yet; may never. VR is dangerous, frankly... and not well enough tested to understand long term side issues. But, my main point is that most of us are using Rf9.5 (happy as clams) and running large screens-- NOT VR. This issue will not be addressed until some critical mass of users move over to VR as their primary video mode. Here's the second point, VR is a pain. While I'm using the Sim I'm constantly using my other senses and my other video feeds and my desk (or lazy boy chair) and having a VR device strapped to my head is not going to fly... so to speak.
marcus

I respect your opinion as VR is a bit like coriander ( Cilantro for my US mates) you either love it or it tastes like soap but your opinion sounds like you are making a statement of fact and in that case you are wrong.

VR works very well for people that can afford the upgrade and don't get motion sickness.

I fly helicopters in real life and RC helicopters and I VR sim and I have never felt better and more confident flying a helicopter in real life. Me? Well like Tom C I wont ever being going back to 2d simming other than the occasional stretch purely for nostalgia.
 
I fly helicopters in real life and RC helicopters and I VR sim and I have never felt better and more confident flying a helicopter in real life. Me? Well like Tom C I wont ever being going back to 2d simming other than the occasional stretch purely for nostalgia.

Thanks for the post; which VR headset do you use? Do you share the opinion that VR fps is unacceptable on Rf9.5 ? Do you see plane shadows also ?

PS edit: heh, yeah, in the Americas cilantro (the Spanish name for Coriander leaves) is used to describe the leaves and stalks of the Coriandrum Sativum plant; typically we still call the spice made from the seeds Coriander. Some of us call it wide-leafy parsley often served in American restaurants as a garnish, or as a primary spice in many forms of salsa. I've never heard it described as tasting like "soap"; however, it is an acquired taste and personally, I love it.


marcus
 
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Thanks for the post; which VR headset do you use? Do you share the opinion that VR fps is unacceptable on Rf9.5 ? Do you see plane shadows also ?

PS edit: heh, yeah, in the Americas cilantro (the Spanish name for Coriander leaves) is used to describe the leaves and stalks of the Coriandrum Sativum plant; typically we still call the spice made from the seeds Coriander. Some of us call it wide-leafy parsley often served in American restaurants as a garnish, or as a primary spice in many forms of salsa. I've never heard it described as tasting like "soap"; however, it is an acquired taste and personally, I love it.


marcus

I have a Vive pro and Rf9 is just barely acceptable in VR but you need to turn all the graphics right down and you still get what I call stuttering shadows unless you stick to 3d fields or the grass field. This is because it uses DX 9 as other sims I use such as Aerofly Rc8 are spectacular in VR but the physics I don't think for helicopters is as good as RF.
 
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