Real Flight For PS3

[Spareparts]

Distracting KE programmers aside, I'm all for RealFlight on the XBox360.

Heck, its already on the PC. I'll be an XBox version would be very similar. They could strip it was down, maybe have two of each, airports, planes, and heli, use the Xbox controller (not great, but it has two sticks and a lot of buttons), and sell it on Microsoft's arcade system for $20.

They could then sell expansions for it. Obviously $20 isn't $200, but I'd lay money that they'd sell at least 10x the number of copies on XBox as they have the PC, and they have zero production costs (only development cost).

There's a lot of Xbox users who buy just about every game just to get the achievement points. I really don't think sales would be an issue.

The best part about it is that there would be very little cross-over market. In other words, the Xbox version wouldn't hurt sales of the PC version and vice versa. The general negativity about gaming consoles on this forum shows that.

 

[jeffpn]

they have zero production costs (only development cost).

Which way do you think the KE/GP relationship was formed? Do you think that GP (the distributor) was looking for a software company that could make the sim? I think it's much more likely that KE (the developer) found GP willing to produce and distribute the phyisical product. KE already has zero production costs.

 

[Spareparts]

Which way do you think the KE/GP relationship was formed? Do you think that GP (the distributor) was looking for a software company that could make the sim? I think it's much more likely that KE (the developer) found GP willing to produce and distribute the phyisical product. KE already has zero production costs.

The point was that RF has production costs that a downloadable application on XBox wouldn't have.

That's a good question about who approached who. I wouldn't be surprised to hear that GP went looking for a KE, but you may be right, it could have been the other way around. I'm not sure though how it applies to G4 on a Xbox.

 

[js3862]

I'm kind of curious who exactly is supposed to be the target market for this PS3, Xbox 360, Wii version of RF.

RC enthusiasts want a sim that is going to represent flying as closely as possible. Without a controller that could be used with the sim you aren't going to get that level of realism with a game console controller. So, RC enthusiasts probably wouldn't find this a useful tool on a game console, even if it were a full version, without a full size RC controller or comparable.

Gamers would likely find a chopped down version, much less the full version, rather mundane as there aren't really any game features in RF save doing some of the challenges and even those aren't really point driven "games" that a regular game console player would find really exciting or challenging.

Then you move into the "Flight Simulator" enthusiast group that have been keeping apps like Microsoft Flight Simulator running for years. I would think that even for this crowd, which would have a natural tendency to want to try a new flight sim "game", that RF as a sim would fall short due to not having all the little do-dads, heading adjustments, fuel mix, auto pilot and whatever else to mess with. This due to the fact that RF doesn't try to be a flight simulator for full size aircraft like MFS and others do.

Then there is the fact that flight sim products for the Xbox 360, PS3 and Wii already exist. So, RF, which is a niche product to begin with is going to be developed, put into distribution, marketed, and stocked next to competing products for perhaps 5% of the gaming population to maybe buy?

So, if I have this right, what this boils down to is a request to design, develop, market and distribute a product: whose current customer base most likely won't use it, has a primary new customer base that would find it far too dull, has a secondary new customer base that would find it too simple, and faces competition on all platforms from more mature game style flight sim products which would appeal to a larger percentage of the primary new customer base group. You sir have a future working for the Obama administration! Pack your bags and head to DC!

Could you do me a favor and write this up in business venture proposal format and submit it to GP? I'm very curious to see how they respond.

 

[Norton]

I think you pretty much covered it js3862! Cheers.....

 

[skyhawk_au]

I'm curious how old you are, skyhawk? I'm betting a teenager, but no way are you out of your 20s. I'd find it hard to believe you're over 25.

All I have to say is WOW! Where did this come from.
For the record, Jeffpn is not in favor. Noted

Your wrong about the age thing by the way.

And to clairify. I never refered to this as a game, it is a sim.

I am also not suggesting using a ps3 remote to use the sim. they would obviously have to create a blue tooth R/C remote identical to the current one.

 

[rccardude04]

Anti Aliasing makes a HUGE difference in picture quality.

Even not-so-current video cards will output 1080p. Heck, my system will do that. And run RealFlight.

I have twice the video memory of the PS3.

A lot more RAM.

A little less CPU power but it's certainly PLENTY for the physics. Graphics are the important thing in modern computing. CPUs are rarely the bottle neck they used to be.

-Eric

 

[skyhawk_au]

Anti Aliasing makes a HUGE difference in picture quality.

Even not-so-current video cards will output 1080p. Heck, my system will do that. And run RealFlight.

I have twice the video memory of the PS3.

A lot more RAM.

A little less CPU power but it's certainly PLENTY for the physics. Graphics are the important thing in modern computing. CPUs are rarely the bottle neck they used to be.

-Eric

Eric you are correct.

There are alot of computers better then PS3.

Sorry I asked guys.

 

[wjkssmd]

At this point, one would have to think; If there was a market for such a device, someone would have exploited it by now. It is hard to find financing for an unproven market, so if it happens, it will probably come from someones garage and a bunch of laid off programmers looking for a start-up opportunity.

The RC PC sim is such a cross-over application that it does not solidly fit in the gaming world yet uses a lot of the technology and graphics. It is not as stable of an application requiring updates and tweeks that it seems to fit better in the PC world. As with most products, if you really want it, you will bend to their hardware requirements.

 

[HX3D014]

All I have to say is WOW! Where did this come from.
For the record, Jeffpn is not in favor. Noted

Your wrong about the age thing by the way.

And to clairify. I never refered to this as a game, it is a sim.

I am also not suggesting using a ps3 remote to use the sim. they would obviously have to create a blue tooth R/C remote identical to the current one.

Don't mind Jeff. he is a good guy if you don't kick him eh

we are a bit protective of the diminishing PC market (Thanks to Eye candy MS Xbox and PS3.s and that ridiculously useless Wii stuff ) but that is a PC users Opinion. <Mine>)

I will throw jeff a good O and he will be distracted for the while

Jeff;
You had 99.99% of a chance of getting that age guess Correct. they were good odds eh

Here. Fetch Boy

Here is your reward

All Jokes aside.

Do not feel sorry for bringing it up. it is a way to find the live opinions.


Bryce.

PS welcome to the Forums.

Where in Australia are you (Guessing Au is for Australia. or is that Gold or is that a State within the USA?)

 

[Spareparts]

At this point, one would have to think; If there was a market for such a device, someone would have exploited it by now.

If everyone thought like this, then no one would ever produce any product - ever.

 

[Spareparts]

Then there is the fact that flight sim products for the Xbox 360, PS3 and Wii already exist. So, RF, which is a niche product to begin with is going to be developed, put into distribution, marketed, and stocked next to competing products for perhaps 5% of the gaming population to maybe buy?

[...]

Could you do me a favor and write this up in business venture proposal format and submit it to GP? I'm very curious to see how they respond.

Let's see - using your number of 5% of the 30 million Xbox 360 users is 1.5 million, times $20 is $30 million. I don't know the financials behind Xbox arcade, so I don't know how much of this they take home.

I'm guessing that KE sells about 250,000 copies of G4 a year, at about $125, of which probably $80 or so is profit, making the comany's annual income about $20 million per year.

So a potential of $30M for a company to spin off a minor variant of a product that currently brings in $20M annually would be pretty tempting for me.

I don't want to be KE's financial advisor. I just want to play G4 on my Xbox. I'll admit that I don't know its true financial viability, but I don't think you do either.

 

[js3862]

Let's see - using your number of 5% of the 30 million Xbox 360 users is 1.5 million, times $20 is $30 million. I don't know the financials behind Xbox arcade, so I don't know how much of this they take home.

I'm guessing that KE sells about 250,000 copies of G4 a year, at about $125, of which probably $80 or so is profit, making the comany's annual income about $20 million per year.

So a potential of $30M for a company to spin off a minor variant of a product that currently brings in $20M annually would be pretty tempting for me.

I don't want to be KE's financial advisor. I just want to play G4 on my Xbox. I'll admit that I don't know its true financial viability, but I don't think you do either.

The number 5% was an estimate of the aggregate number of console gamers in total not specifically Xbox 360 users which was why I specifically mentioned Xbox, PS3 and Wii just prior to that. You also failed to recognize the overly obvious use of the word, directly following the estimate, (here I'll do it again) maybe, which goes to further reduce the prospect that the percentage would be a solid one. So, the statement was that maybe 5% of that entire group would be interested in purchasing such a product. The implication being, 'but probably not' based on the argument I laid out above that statement.

KE hasn't provided me with their FY '08 data yet so, no I don't have any solid numbers concerning how many copies they sold last year, their margins or their net profit. As soon as I get that information I'll give you an update.

However, in the meantime, I do know the product sells for just under $200 not $125. (That must be the price of the other product your trying to convince people to produce a console version of) You may want to use that number when doing your research and creating estimates for the proposal.

I'm dropping this thread from my subscriptions so PM me if you need anything else and I'll reply in the forum.

 

[Spareparts]

KE hasn't provided me with their FY '08 data yet so, no I don't have any solid numbers concerning how many copies they sold last year, their margins or their net profit. As soon as I get that information I'll give you an update.

I'm surprised that you don't have that data, since you were speaking with such authority.

However, in the meantime, I do know the product sells for just under $200 not $125. (That must be the price of the other product your trying to convince people to produce a console version of) You may want to use that number when doing your research and creating estimates for the proposal.

$125 is my guess at the wholesale price, the $80 is my guess at wholesale minus production costs.

I'm dropping this thread from my subscriptions so PM me if you need anything else and I'll reply in the forum.

That's ok. Our exchanges haven't been particularly productive anyway.

 

[jeffpn]

If the AMA only has 170,000 members, how is KE selling 250,000 copies of RF per year? I know you don't have to be a member of the AMA to buy RF, but I'm sure there's a corellation. KE, congratulations on your $20M earnings per year! I had no idea!

 

[Spareparts]

If the AMA only has 170,000 members, how is KE selling 250,000 copies of RF per year? I know you don't have to be a member of the AMA to buy RF, but I'm sure there's a corellation. KE, congratulations on your $20M earnings per year! I had no idea!

I originally guessed 100,000, but then raised it before I posted the message. I don't think its too out of line. I'm not in AMA and I own RF, so that makes 1.

If it is way out of line, that just makes the Xbox case more appealing.

I agree that all the arguments in favor of porting it to the Xbox are based on pure speculation and wishful thinking. My real point to the other poster was that so are all the arguments against it.

 

[Heeleycopter]

I'm not an AMA member either and I own a copy of G4.5, my brother has G3 and hes not an AMA member. People that are curious about R/C flying like sims, I have FSX and a $250 yoke and pedal setup but I dont have a pilots license. Straw man argument jeffpn.

 

[jeffpn]

For the record, I'm not an AMA member now, either. But I will be in the next couple months. In fact, for the 4 years I lived in Steubenville, I wasn't, either. And that's most of the time I've owned a RF product. I had no club field to fly at. But why would you want a sim of any sort if you don't do the real thing? Of course, there are exceptions, I stated that in my post. I still say that most people who own RF are now, or soon will be AMA members. Most clubs require it. And the whole point of my post is to say that KE's target market would be the AMA membership. Who else could they target? Good Housekeeping subscribers?

 

[js3862]

I'm surprised that you don't have that data, since you were speaking with such authority.

You don't have to have KE's financials in order to use your brain and speak as though you can.

That's ok. Our exchanges haven't been particularly productive anyway.

I'm glad you got the point of my removing my subscription.

 

[Heeleycopter]

But why would you want a sim of any sort if you don't do the real thing?

LOL so I guess everybody who has a "racing sim" is also a race car driver, MSFS is a pilot etc? I sim because I cant do the real thing.